Updates have been few and far inbetween right now, now because we are not working but rather because we have hit what I call the long tail of software development.
Our prime focus currently is to get the first combined NotEye/ADOM release out but this entails still a lot of detail work. We are hard on it and many other parts are being fiddled with (see below) but there is little externally visible process.
As I am going to be traveling a fair bit during the next couple of weeks I have decided to switch my attention for a moment in order to proceed with the ADOM RPG. So here's the task list we are working on right now:
- Jochen and Zeno and slugging away to get the first ADOM/NotEye release out of the door. We intend to be p12 the first such release. Jochen in particular still has to fiddle a fair bit withe build system, dependency management, etc.
- Lucas is working hard on more and more soundtracks. Slowly but steadily an impressive score is being gathered.
- Krys is painting his soul away, below you can see the latest character variant update:
- Sadly we also kind of encountered a problem we all totally forgot to take into consideration when doing the initial estimation: we forgot about female monster variants - which probably adds another 120 or so monsters and hardly will fit into our budget schedule :-( Damn. See the problem:
- Due to the traveling mentioned above I am going to focus on the ADOM Lite RPG for a couple of weeks to get it to a much more complete state.
Additionally it's time for more community input. Two main issues need to be decided in order to implement them in the near future:
First of all we need to get a better idea what to do with all the new quests and maps that will be added to the game. I have a slew of ideas but I also would like to hear your input. Generally I intend to use them to make the early game more accessible and fun (but not all of them ;-) ) and I also want fill some plot holes in order to get rid of the need for spoilers. Now tell me: What would you like to see the new maps and quests get used for?
Secondly it's time for the achievements system. Jochen already has started working on the server infrastructure and client protocol for that, too, and we now would love to have more input for cool achievements. Long-time supporter and fan Sascha Schnitzer already sent me the following batch of ideas which I like a lot but there's surely a lot of cool stuff we haven't yet thought of:
It Starts Easy
Die your first death.
Time Flies If You're Having Fun
Die due to old age.
You were eaten by a grue.
Rocks Fall, Everyone Dies
Become a gaming cliché. [Death through falling rocks.]
Things Were Better Back Then
Restore a character from permadeath.
Find a si.
Recover from being doomed.
Have Fate smile upon you.
Resist a total of X points of fire damage.
Mad Carpenter No More
Find a way to cure Yrrigs.
A Child's Hero
Save a puppy from certain doom.
Slay a dragon. Easy, right?
Become sick from food poisoning.
Kill an enemy with poison.
Give and Take
Spend a total of 90,169 gold pieces in shops with one character.
Avatar of Thieves
Steal an item worth at least 6,666 gold pieces.
I Can Do This All Night
Spend 60 days continuously under water.
Become a cannibal with every player race.
Stick them with the pointy end!
Dual-wield Needle and Sting.
Filk Will Never Die!
So let's gather your input and stay tuned. Hopefully will be real soon now able to do the groundbreaking ADOM/NotEye release :-)
Artwork looks mighty fine.ReplyDelete
I hate achievements! So often are they the CPR to keep a dead horse kicking.ReplyDelete
Ok after saying that some games implement them for a humorous effect, i.e. King's Quest "achievements" for dying in various ways. But as it stands if your game (talking about any game, not just ADOM) is not attractive enough for a player to keep playing without the need to hunt for sometimes so arbitrary "achievements" then achievements won't actually make it any more attractive really in my view. Cause at the point when you're playing for achievements you're not playing for exploration or fun. It is a way of games to tell you the player what you're supposed to be "achieving", how you're supposed to be playing. It also breaks immersion somewhat by introducing a meta layer.
Anyway I'll stop here because I know that there's gonna be people who find nothing wrong with achievements expressing their contrary views and I can't quite find the words I was looking for. And I know my exposition here was quite vehement when it doesn't really need to be. Just a gut reaction to the words "achievements system" so I hope you'll forgive me and I'm eager to hear what others think about this topic.
Is gender at all relevant for most monsters? I recall it's only really relevant for one or two... if that's the case, could you remove gender specifications for almost all the monsters, for the time being at least?ReplyDelete
This is probably the best course of action. It would hopefully just be temporary until Thomas can afford the extra tiles.Delete
I think the classic ADOM challenge games are almost a "must" as achievements, since the community has been treating them as such, even without a formal achievement system :) The ADOM Guidebook has a list of challenge games:ReplyDelete
Of course these would be among the hardest achievements, but most Steam games have a wide range of achievements (from very simple ones for newbies to ultra-hard to boast).
In addition, other achievements could be:
(WARNING, SPOILERS AHEAD)
Close call - Reach full health after having been at 1 HP (or alternately, survive X turns after being at 1 HP)
Near-death experience - Be saved by an AoLS
Blanket Run - Enter the SMC at level 1 and take the blanket
Full Blanket Run - Enter the SMC at level 1, take the blanket, and exit through the HMV (without exiting to the wilderness through the SMC!)
Unconventional Gourmet - Cook a corpse by frying it with a fire bolt and eat it
Friend of the Felines - Complete the cat quest
Champion of the Arena - As the name says
Soul Saver - Free Griff's Soul
Just in Time - Save Khelavaster
Sneaky Bastard - Get past the Eternal Guardian without carrying the ring
Egyptologist - Kill Rehetep
Bookworm - Get the Weird Tome
Theseus - Get the Minotaur Axe
Martial Arts Adept - Get level 5 on unarmed fighting
Kung Fu Master - Get grand mastery on unarmed fighting
Psychopath - Kill everyone in Terinyo
Animal tamer - Tame an animal with food or with music
Master of Water - Obtain the Water Orb
Master of Fire - Obtain the Fire Orb
Master of Earth - Obtain the Earth Orb
Master of Air - Obtain the Air Orb
Master of Mana - Obtain the Mana Orb
Dragon Slayer - Kill one dragon of each kind
Wyrm Slayer - Kill one wyrm of each kind
La la la I can't hear you - Be deaf when the Banshee wails
Masochist - Wish for monsters
Lucky sip - Get a wish from a pool
MORE SNAKES - Get snakes from a pool, then get a wish from the same pool, wish for more snakes - OK, this is probably not very good but I had to say it, it's a forum joke :P
Shoplifter - Successfully rob a shop
Ocean's Eleven - Successfully rob the Casino shop
Deep Dive - Reach level 50 of the ID
Very Deep Dive - Reach level 100 of the ID
Nature hater - win without using herbs
Magic hater - win without using magic
Weapon hater - win without using weapons
Consistent believer - win without ever changing alignment
Strangest death ever - be killed by an exploding frog
ADOM is so large and full of possibilities that there are lots of possible achievements, these are just the ones coming to my head right now!
Wow, some nice ideas. Completely forgot about AoLS and banshee.Delete
About last four - AFAIR there were some talks about automatic challenge tracking - I don't remember if it got into funded features.
How much money will you need to fund the artwork female variants? If you can manage the schedule, maybe we can manage the funding... maybe file it under ~fair gender representation in video games~ReplyDelete
Please don't remove female monsters, or if you do so, do it as an option, so that we can still play with female monsters if we play in ASCII mode (where graphics are not relevant).ReplyDelete
Umm... so, achievments.ReplyDelete
Well, there are „do N things“ kind, „finish a quest“ kind, „kill a boss monster“ kind and „do a special thing“ kind.
I personally like fourth kind most. And first three do not require that much imagination. Using all of final score achievements is a good idea (and some has been already proposed). Getting into Library or unlocking the bug temple should be noted, as well as all (or most) quests.
A few achievements I'd love to see:
- Crushed by kicking stairs.
Power at my fingertips
- Successfully read Wish tome.
Should've thought twice
- Misused a wish (by wishing immortality, etc.)
It's called Chaos for a reason
- Corrupted to WMoPC by using elemental orb.
- Used scroll of great identify.
- Kicked a beehive.
- Dipped item in !oEx. Or hit a monster with it.
- Identified X items (say, 250, or more) with one character.
Why did you do that?
- Finished Riurry's quest.
It's dangerous to go alone
- Summoned a familiar.
- Got drunk.
- Went through Living Forest not attacking any trees.
- Dealt with Demented ratling.
- Killed monster with alchemical fireball.
- Mixed !oGA.
I wouldn't create any achievements involving death. Eventually someone will begin to collect achievements and having to commit suicide in order to get some of them doesn't look like a good philosophy to me.ReplyDelete
For genre with this high ratio of death/victories it isn't that hard to get such achievements in the process.Delete
Though there certainly shouldn't be more than, say, five or six of them.
It is nice if you think of it like getting them eventually as you play, but it feels wrong at the time you start going after the achievements.Delete
The Fallen Hermit: Survive a fall from climbing mountains whilst starving.ReplyDelete
Friendship is Magic: Spend time with a black wizardDelete
There's a typo in "Attonement", should be "Atonement". I also like how the si achievement tells the beginner they're on to something important.ReplyDelete
In addition to achievements listed by Al-Khwarizmi, there is much more meaningful stuff that could classify as an achievement (i.e. something you have to *achieve*).
Yep, All Done!
Leave the Drakalor Chain after having closed the gate.
I'm Bad... But I Feel Good!
Achieve the Ordinary Chaos God ending.
Everything For This Moment
Achieve the Ultra ending.
Plunged Into Nonexistence
Achieve the Ultimate Nihilist Ending.
...And Throw Away The Key
Close the Chaos gate.
Notable challenges (just formalizing what has been said earlier):
Complete the game without visiting any locations except the Caverns of Chaos and the Tower of Eternal Flames.
Retrieve the Chaos Sceptre from the Special Infinity Level without entering any other locations, then leave the game.
Level up to 50 in the wilderness without entering any locations.
Complete the game at a very low experience level. (Level 1 is possible, but the limit should probably be upped.)
Level up to 50 in the Small Cave without visiting any other locations.
Complete the game after having killed every type of monster in the game, except the mutually exclusive ones. (Maybe there should be a certain small leeway for this?)
Complete the game within 40000 turns.
Complete the game within 20000 turns.
Complete the game within 10000 turns.
Score 10 million points.
Score 25 million points.
Score 50 million points.
Don't Need 'Em Smarts
Complete the game with an illiterate character (<50 Literacy).
Complete the game with every class.
Other gameplay-related challenges (some should probably be hidden):
The White Eagle
Become an avatar of Order.
The Grey Hawk
Become an avatar of Balance.
The Black Vulture
Become an avatar of Chaos.
At Ease With The Divine
Get (pre-/post-) crowned five or more times in the same game.
It's Not So Black And White
Start as Lawful or Neutral, drop alignment to Chaotic, collect the Chaos Trinity artifacts, go back to being Lawful or Neutral.
Successfully complete all the time-limited sidequests in the same game. (Kranach, cute dog, minotaur emperor, etc. Kranach's corpse must be given to the sheriff; the dog must survive.)
Collect 18 artifacts in the same game.
What Are You Going To Do With These?
Collect all the artifacts that contain the essence of Chaos and Corruption in the same game. (That is, the Chaos Trinity, the Raw Steel trinity, Boots of Great Speed, and the Black Tome of Alsophocus.)
Virtues Are Always Rewarded
Pick up True Strength.
Not So Useless
Get awarded with an artifact for finding a use for the potion of uselessness.
Desecrate every grave in both graveyards.
It's A Miracle!
Survive the final onslaught of sickness while at <12 To.
The Downward Spiral
Attain the maximum amount of concurrent corruptions.
I Hate Minotaurs
Explore all the dead-end branches of the minotaur maze (at least 70% of the map must be revealed on each floor).
Remove the maximum allowed amount of corruptions all in one go.
Kill 10+ bosses during the same game.
Get any single attribute to 50+ points.
Get all attributes to 40+ points during the same game.
Also for some fun stuff:
Become sacrificed by an enemy.
Greatly anger your deity or sacrifice yourself.
Take A Wrong Turn
Enter the Chaos Plane without the proper gear.
I Better Leave
Leave the Drakalor Chain without having closed the Chaos gate.
Collect n achievements. (Will depend on the total amount of achievements; thinking 40% or so.)
Collect n achievements. (~80% of the total.)
Collect all achievements.
And some more:Delete
There's No Such Thing As Overkill
Get awarded with Trident of the Red Rooster
Most Unpleasant Customer
Make 3+ shopkeepers hostile during the same game.
Die by iron poisoning when playing as a Mist Elf.
So Which One Is It?
Have Cursed, Doomed, Lucky, and Fate Smiles intrinsics all at the same time.
Enter the bug-infested temple.
Deal over 150 points of damage to a single target with a single attack, counted after PV reduction.
Don't Want To Be Here
Discover a threat room filled with Emperor Liches.
I think the "don't change alignment" achievement should be split into 3 achievements, one for each alignment, since the game plays different depending which you stick with.ReplyDelete
Is it me, or is "Cannibalism, ho!" impossible, due to the lack of high/grey/mist elf, gnome, and drakeling monsters? Or would other things count for those, i.e. dark elves for other elves, lizard men for drakelings, et cetera?ReplyDelete
I think the best achievements are the ones that make you play the game a little different than you might normally(do a side quest, go a different route, etc.). Along the same line, I think having an individual achievement for beating the game with each class would be great, not just one achievement for beating it with every class. Going further, you could even think up some system to give a bronze/silver/gold medal for each class depending on something like score, time, or a combination.ReplyDelete
I think that a really neat quest would be to befriend a certain number of animals and bring them to a druid or some other critter-friendly guy. It would give a little more benefit to the music skills in game. The reward could be based on the variety and relative strength of the creatures.ReplyDelete
Brrriiinnnggg mmmmeeee ttttooo liiiiiffffffeee! - Use Necromancy successfully. (Nod to EvanescenceReplyDelete
I like the Druid Druid, I like the ... DRUID! - Reach level 50 with a Druid class (Old Chewits advert in the UK)
Who's the hero now, Mr Frodo? - Complete the game as a Hobbit Farmer (or Reach level 50 as a Hobbit Farmer?)
This useless scroll is so useless. Let's throw it away - Won't spoil this one
Head Lich? Not a problem! - Slay an Emperor Lich
Assassinate the Assassin like an Assassin - Backstab a friendly Assassin with an Assassin.
Mindless Negative Feedback - Be damaged/killed by mindcrafting backlash when using mindcraft on Undead
I'm not really good with these things.
Now, Negative feedback is really nice.Delete
Others... well, as a past of „get to level 50 with a class X“ group of achievements. Also I didn't get first two at all.
Don't kill any animal for any reson.
Train the cute dog up to level X.
Build a bridge through an ordinary river :)
Dig a grave as a result of unsuccessfull book reading.
Kick down a wall with a monk.
Succesfully bookcast a wish with all atrributes at 1.
Succesfully finish the game without eating any meat or corpses.
Carbon Fiber Man
Only 100s of inventory can be carried at any given time.
The PC does not acknowledge the existence of the gods, never asks for divine assistance and never uses an altar for any reason.
Offer piece to a monster.
"Stick them with the pointy end!"ReplyDelete
Heh, I hadn't even realized that Needle could be considered a George R.R. Martin shoutout. (Retroactively, I assume, since ADOM was released in 1994, and AGoT in 1996, though I don't know if Needle and Sting were in the game already.)
Funny dark sage! But then, considering achievements.ReplyDelete
I would like to see, how many people have the same game experience - through funny achievements maybe, or through longer and clearer description, or probably just a few hints on player's general game style. Also there certainly may be rare achievements.
Prerelease 12 is now available... you know where to get it.ReplyDelete
If there are achievements for winning the game with various races or classes, here are names I'd suggest.ReplyDelete
Oh, the Humanity! - Human
Me Smash Everything! - Troll
Above It All - High Elf
Shades of Gray - Gray Elf
Darkest Hour - Dark Elf
King of the Mountain - Dwarf
Ultimate Prankster - Gnome
Half-Sized Hero - Hurthling
Leader of the Horde - Orc
Highly Evolved Reptile - Drakeling
From the Mists of Time (or maybe Race Against the Time) - Mist Elf
Mighty Vermin - Ratling
Fellowship of Ancardia - win the game with all races.
Hack & Slash - Fighter
True Champion - Paladin
Free-Range - Ranger
Master Thief - Thief
Silent Killer - Assassin
Archmage - Wizard
God's Best Buddy - Priest
Sane Minstrel - Bard
Enlightenment - Monk
Heal the World - Healer
Mr. Smith - Weaponsmith
Farslayer - Archer
Business as Usual - Merchant
Garden of Eden - Farmer
Mind Over Matter - Mindcrafter
Unnecessary Brutality - Barbarian
One With Nature - Druid
Gravelord - Necromancer
Elementary, Dear Khelavaster - Elementalist
Beast of the Best - Beastfighter
MaStEr Of ChAoS - Chaos Knight
Dueled the World - Duelist
Jack of All Trades - won as characters of all classes
Nice Try - attempt to wish for more wishes
Beloved by Fate - win the game with a character obtained by letting fate decide
This Really Hurths - train thrown rocks or slings to high level with a hurthling character
Also, "Time Flies If You're Having Fun" might be better as "Time Flies When You're Having Fun".
Prerelease 13 is now finished, it contains a very important bugfix, so please upgrade if you are playing Prerelease 12!ReplyDelete
Great! Thanks for the bugfix, it was unmotivating to play without bolts.ReplyDelete
Someone's been playing Recettear.
About new quests. Maybe it is worth to make alternative quest chain for dark characters like ChAoS knight. There is a few chaotic quests, but as far as I know, they cant be encontered early in game and the dont form any specific plot.ReplyDelete
So im suggesting to make more readable 'dark' path. It will help to fill some plot holes, and will make easier to add other Chaotic races and classes in future (if planned so) =)